Testeado por Peter Shapiro
Extractos del Invisible Jukebox de The Wire de un número de 1999.
Nacidos en 1970 y 1972 respectivamente, Rob Brown y Sean Booth se criaron con una dieta constante de Mantronix, graffiti, BMX y 808 State. Después de reunirse en 1987 y una temporada en la radio pirata en Manchester, el dúo lanzó su primer sencillo, "Cavity Job", bajo el nombre de MYSLB Productions en 1991. Sin embargo, Brown y Booth no entrarían en el ojo público hasta el año siguiente, cuando "The Egg" y "Crystel" de Autechre aparecieron en la compilación de Artificial Intelligence que define la escena de Warp. Su álbum debut, Incunabula, fue lanzado en 1993, su Electro ligeramente sesgado siguiendo un diagrama esquemático propio. Una exploración hermética de los contornos de sus máquinas Roland 303 y 606 favoritas. El álbum de Autechre de 1994, Amber, fue su gran avance. Después de lanzar el Anti EP, que contenía ritmos deliberadamente 'no repetitivos', hicieron lo mismo con Tri Repetae (1995), Chiastic Slide (1997) y el año pasado LP5, desarrollando formas electrónicas opacas talladas en la suciedad del sistema y unidas de acuerdo con reglas que eran cualquier cosa menos euclidianas. Los EP para Clear y Skam como Gescom (abreviatura de Gestalt Communications) pueden o no haber sido Booth y Brown. Las sesiones Peel Sessions de Autechre se lanzan este mes en Warp, y el dúo se encuentra actualmente en Sheffield trabajando en sus propios proyectos de software.
JUST ICE
"Cold Gettin' Dumb" from Absolutely The Very Best Of Old School HipHop
(Castle)
"Cold Gettin' Dumb" from Absolutely The Very Best Of Old School HipHop
(Castle)
Sean Booth: Esto suena maravilloso. Creo que realmente me hubiera gustado esto en 1986 si saliera en una etiqueta de Nueva York. Oh, tenemos que saber quién es.
Rob Brown: Está fuera de tiempo, ¿no?
SB: Parece que fue producido por un genio. ¿Quien podría ser? ¿Algunas ideas?
RB: No quiero decir realmente, porque podría ser mucha gente, ¿no?
SB: Suena como el tipo de sello que estaría en Broadway, pero eso es solo una suposición. Parece que un geezer latino lo produjo de todos modos.
¿Porque eso?
SB: No lo sé, tiene un giro flojo.
RB: Es el tipo de persona que probablemente probaría sus cajas de ritmos y no las usaría, sino que simplemente las probaría y conseguiría que muchos niños latinos las editaran también.
SB: Me recuerda a Duke Bootee, pero ...
Estás cerca.
SB: Probablemente sea de Manhattan y probablemente no trabaje tan bien con sus raperos.
No.
SB: No recuerdo quién es. ¿Quién es?
Es Just Ice, con Mantronik produciendo.
RB: Sí, he oído hablar de él. Es maldito.
¿Fue Mantronik una gran influencia entonces?
SB: ¿Qué te parece? [Risas]
RB: En realidad, es bastante nuevo en cubrir sus huellas con este chico. Nunca se sabe, bueno, ya sabes cómo lo ha hecho, pero ...
SB: No se anuncia solo.
RB: Por el momento, el equipo que tenía estaba bastante avanzado.
SB: Estaba usando un SP-12 cuando las personas a su alrededor usaban un 808. Sí, y Emus. Estaba jodidamente golpeando básicamente.
RB: Fue el primer chico, en realidad, que pudo controlar el inicio y detener el movimiento del aire en la música. A diferencia de un 808 tocado infinitamente, tienes un sampler que se detiene finitamente, y él aprovecha al máximo eso.
SB: Sí, entendió totalmente su tecnología, no en términos de sus limitaciones, solo en términos de su capacidad. No fue el primero en hacer lo que estaba haciendo, pero probablemente fue la primera persona que supo cómo usar el sampler en HipHop para crear nuevas dinámicas con su kit, en lugar de simplemente intentar recrear las dinámicas existentes con samplers, que es lo que la mayoría de la gente estaba haciendo. En la segunda mitad de los años 80, básicamente fue él quien mejoró y todos los demás empeoraron, excepto The Bomb Squad, que se enfrentó desde su propio ángulo por completo. Eso fue algo así para nosotros entonces. Creo que era realmente bueno teniendo conceptos invisibles en sus cosas.
RB: Exactamente, porque los chicos HipHop no aceptan los conceptos.
SB: No, no lo harán. Solo quieren el aspecto estilístico de algún tipo de "realidad". Mientras que lo estaba empujando hacia adelante.
RB: Él no lo estaba mostrando al final. Creo que todos lo jodieron porque se fue ... Estuvo aislado por mucho tiempo, eso fue lo que pasó. Creo que probablemente se volvió tan futurista que decidió tratar de mantenerse al día con todos los demás, y así es como perdió la trama, en cuanto a dónde iban los demás, y terminó haciendo un montón de discos de soul. Eso lo manchó totalmente.
¿Qué crees que le quitaron?
SB: Realmente se inspiró más en él como persona. Era solo su forma de ser, la forma en que aplicaba lo que sabía y en lo que estaba metido.
RB: Era un poco zorro.
SB: Sí, definitivamente. Era un poco un héroe. Es un poco extraño porque solo recuerdas lo que pensabas cuando eras niño en lugar de recordarlo. Realmente no podía decir ahora qué estaba haciendo en términos de la técnica que me estaba haciendo girar. Creo que era solo que él siempre estaba presionando. Cheese era igual. Quiero decir que Cheese estaba produciendo cosas al mismo tiempo, alrededor del 86, que estaba muy bien hecho, hecho de forma exuberante. Él encarna muchas cosas que la gente ahora da por sentado, especialmente los productores de jungle.
...
DAVID TUDOR
"Pulsers" de Three Works For Live Electronics (Lovely Music)
SB: Suena como Chris Carter.
RB: ¿Es una grabación en vivo?
Si.
RB: No me importaría ver eso.
SB: Suena genial, sea quien sea. No es David Tudor o algo así, ¿verdad?
Sí, una grabación en vivo de 1976.
SB: Creo que tiene un oído extraño.
¿Crees que hay algo nuevo que puedes hacer con la electrónica en vivo que no puedes hacer en el estudio?
SB: Sí, por completo. Eres completamente lineal, solo puedes lidiar con un marco de tiempo. Tiene la capacidad de alterar tu perspectiva, o tu entorno de trabajo dentro de ese plazo puede estar completamente bajo tu control. En vivo, puedes darte todo el control que quieras.
RB: Definitivamente eres más un conducto en vivo.
SB: Definitivamente estás limitado a trabajar dentro de un período de tiempo y de una manera puramente lineal, por lo que no estás realmente preocupado por eventos futuros de la misma manera, por lo que no estás realmente preocupado por eventos pasados de manera un poco diferente, no tanto. Definitivamente cambia la forma en que trabajas en cosas: estás mucho más preocupado por las cosas en el presente que cuando trabajas en el estudio, porque no hay presente. A menos que estés trabajando en vivo en el estudio, que es como, uh, live, en sí = [Risas]
RB: Sí, pero sabes que será abordado y evaluado con la actitud que has tenido en el estudio.
SB: Si eso es lo que has decidido hacer ... Creo que la línea divisoria se está volviendo realmente delgada porque ahora hay tantas cosas que puedes cambiar. Cuando estaba haciendo cosas, sin una red masiva de computadoras, no podías hacerlo... Hay tantas formas diferentes de hacerlo ahora que la cuestión de si es en vivo o no es casi irrelevante, porque estás haciendo algo para que lo use, luego lo usa y le da la mayor flexibilidad posible. Es como ser DJ, de verdad.
En el rock, hay un elemento de peligro al hacerlo en vivo, puedes equivocarte de verdad, pero en la electrónica ese elemento de riesgo parece ser menos frecuente.
RB: No, no lo creo. Depende de cuánto riesgo te arriesgas realmente.
SB: Dejar un sonido abierto en el sintetizador que puedes editar es permitirte arruinarlo. Controlar las curvas del filtro es permitirte arruinarlo, si las resonancias están demasiado altas. Hay potencial para joder todo lo que hacemos. Es tonto decir que un concierto electrónico no puede sonar a mierda si presionas los botones equivocados.
RB: Sí, totalmente. Hay un millón de notas sin valor para escuchar en cualquier tipo de concierto.
SB: No hay más o menos posibilidades de arruinarlo que una banda de guitarras. Al menos en una banda de guitarras, alguien lo jode, el resto de la banda puede seguir tocando.
RB: Seamos realistas, alguien como Jim O'Rourke tocando una guitarra acústica frente a un micrófono es igual de arriesgado. Es extraño confiar en estas cajas. Si usas herramientas que has diseñado, debes ser un poco más inteligente que el siguiente hombre porque si se rompe, una, es tu culpa y, dos, si lo arreglas, sabes cómo funciona y, tres, has aprendido algo.
DICK RAAIJMAKERS
"Ping Pong" de The Complete Works (Donemus)
SB: Está bien, esto. ¿Que es esto? Es realmente lindo
RB: Ping pong.
Sí, es una grabación de dos paletas de ping pong con micrófono de contacto. Intentaban encontrar el algoritmo de una bola que desaceleraba, ¿no es así?
SB: Eso fue algo que hicimos hace dos años. Es solo matemática básica. Fue entonces cuando empezamos a generar ... Generativo es una palabra tan jodidamente estúpida, en realidad. No es en absoluto generativo. Es una especie de hipercreatividad, supongo. Es una palabra desagradable. De todos modos, esa fue una de las primeras cosas que hicimos, tratando de hacer ejercicio ...
RB: Es estructural, de verdad.
SB: Estábamos haciendo eso en 1995, 96. Fue entonces cuando comenzamos a usar computadoras y otras cosas.
¿Por qué se metieron en eso?
SB: Creo que nos dimos cuenta de que éramos mucho más capaces con MIDI y matemáticas. MIDI es simplemente un sistema entero bastante sorprendente. Podrías hacer mucho con eso y una vez que hicimos clic en eso, las cosas se expandieron.
¿Crees que hay algo divertido en convertir las matemáticas en música?
SB: Uno es el otro de todos modos.
RB: Escuchando cosas viejas que has hecho, usando los mismos principios, pero no planeando esos principios, sino simplemente explorándolos y entrando en ellos, dándote cuenta de que una vez que tienes esta máquina puedes descubrir muchos de las principios. La belleza real en los números utilizados para crear estructuras, es increíblemente interesante.
Están haciendo su propio software ahora, ¿verdad?
SB: Sí. No hay un objetivo, en realidad. Mucho de esto no es música, son solo cosas que nos interesan.
RB: Animación, de verdad. No en términos de representación gráfica, sino algo que puedes desarrollar.
SB: O algo que se anima a sí mismo, o algo que animará otras cosas. Es todo tipo de movimiento diferente. Todo está basado en el tiempo, todo lo que hacemos lo es. Pero no todo es sonido.
RB: [refiriéndose al track] ¿Quién está ganando? No creo que estén jugando un juego serio. Algunos deberían grabar un juego maestro chino. Sería más de los 90, ¿no? [Risas]
SB: Sin embargo, sería tan jodidamente dinámico.
RB: Sí, pero terminaría en unos 90 segundos.
SB: Creo que sería mejor si fuesen buenos jugadores.
...
COIL
"Dimethoxy-4-Ethyl-Amphetamine" from Time Machines (Eskaton)
RB: Solo iba a decir que el sistema de calefacción tiene un tono.
[Ambos adoptan caras decaídas y miran la mesa en silencio durante unos dos minutos]
SB: Suena como COIL. ¿Es Time Machine? Sí, maldición.
RB: Es raro porque suena mucho más viejo.
SB: No puedo escucharlo más. No lo puedo tocar más. La última vez que escuché esto realmente me asustó. Es jodidamente impresionante este CD.
¿No están trabajando con ellos?
SB: Es un proceso largo y lento.
¿Están intercambiando cintas?
SB: Más ideas.
RB: Sí, lanza una clave en los trabajos también.
SB: Respeto, maldito.
¿Qué hay en Coil que les mueve?
SB: Eso es lo que no puedes decir. Se trata de abrir puertas, creo. Abren muchas puertas. No siempre llegan hasta allí, pero simplemente te muestran esta puerta y a veces es un giro.
RB: Coil está solo en una esfera. Por lo general, es bastante cautivador. Son una banda bastante cautivante, de verdad. No importa lo que hagan, hay algo allí que es absolutamente ellos y te mantiene allí.
¿Solían escuchar Dead Can Dance también?
SB: Sí, un poquito. Bits selectos. No demasiado de las cosas cursis del world / etno, más las cosas posteriores. Creo que "The Host Of Seraphin" es hermosa. Eso es al final lo que me gustaba. Me gustaba más que las pistas especializadas en instrumentos.
¿El movimiento industrial significó algo para ustedes?
SB: No venimos desde ese punto de vista en absoluto. Solíamos ir a este club Hardcore, y el DJ, que era totalmente decente, estábamos haciendo esta cosa de radio con él, la hacía. Tocó canciones de Love's Secret Domain a 45", simplemente jodiéndolas totalmente. Siempre le gustaban las cosas raras también.
RB: Sí, solía atormentar a su audiencia bastante. Él estaría tocando para entusiasmar a las multitudes, dejando caer a Coil a 45" en la mezcla.
SB: Fue totalmente impresionante, mirando hacia atrás. Compramos todo lo que estaban haciendo en ese momento y luego retrocedimos e intentamos obtener la mayor cantidad de cosas posible. Es muy denso. Están realmente interesados en lo que están haciendo a un nivel bastante íntimo. Solo están ellos y :zoviet*france: y The Hafler Trio que nos impresionaron en ese momento. Un poco de Chris & Cosey, también, supongo.
¿Crees que compartes una postura hermética con estos chicos?
SB: Creo que así es como lo escuchas. Creo que si estás preparado para ser bombardeado por ciertas cosas, entonces lo aceptas como parte del plan. Comienza a funcionar, es bastante raro. Coil tiene la habilidad de hacer cosas que son bastante enfermizas en cualquier otro lugar y hacerlas totalmente evidentes. Quiero decir, esto es absolutamente asombroso. Es muy fácil de hacer, pero es totalmente efectivo.
...
LFO
"Mentok 1" from Frequencies (Warp)
SB: Rah.
RB: ¿Quién selecciona la música entonces?
Comité.
[Ambos risas] RB: Comité. Esa es una respuesta muy diplomática.
OK, ¿qué tal junta?
SB: LFO nos acaba de golpear de la tabla. Nadie que conociera iba a escucharlo. Todos se metieron en "Testone" de [Sweet Exorcist] cuando eso salió y todos se metieron en "The Theme" y Forgemasters "Track With No Name" ...
RB; Recuerdo que había dos LFOs al mismo tiempo. Ese fue el momento en que salieron como un millón de discos por semana, todos copiándose entre sí.
SB: Eso es verdad. No fue hasta que salió el álbum que los atrapé totalmente ... El lado B fue bastante impresionante. Me perdí totalmente en el álbum, pensé que era increíble.
RB: Solo esperas que salgan todos esos 12 "al mismo tiempo, solo piensas que habrá un millón más para reemplazarlo. Y luego, para alguien aparentemente fuera de baile, escucharlos hacer un álbum de larga duración fue totalmente valioso.
SB: totalmente exuberante.
Tested by Peter Shapiro
Excerpts from The Wire's Invisible Jukebox of an issue of 1999.
Born in 1970 and 1972 respectively, Rob Brown and Sean Booth were both raised on a steady diet of Mantronix, graffiti, BMXs and 808 State. After meeting in 1987 and a stint on pirate radio in Manchester, the duo released their first single, "Cavity Job", under the name MYSLB Productions in 1991. Brown and Booth wouldn't enter the public eye until the following year, though, when Autechre's "The Egg" and "Crystel" appeared on Warp's scene-defining Artificial Intelligence compilation. Their debut album, Incunabula, was released in 1993, its slightly skewed Electro following a schematic diagram all their own. A hermetic exploration of the contours of their favourite Roland 303 and 606 machines. Autechre's 1994 album, Amber, was their breakthrough. After releasing the Anti EP, which contained deliberately 'non-repetitive' beats, they followed suit with Tri Repetae (1995), Chiastic Slide (1997) and last year LP5, developing opaque electronic shapes carved out of system dirt and put together according to rules that were anything but Euclidean. EPs for Clear and Skam as Gescom (short for Gestalt Communications) may or may not have been Booth and Brown. Autechre's Peel Sessions are released this month on Warp, and the duo are currently holed up in Sheffield working on their own software projects.
JUST ICE
"Cold Gettin' Dumb" from Absolutely The Very Best Of Old School HipHop
(Castle)
Sean Booth: This sounds gorgeous. I reckon that i would have really liked this in 1986 if it came out on a label from New York. Oh, we've got to gess who this is.
Rob Brown: It's well out of time, isn't it?
SB: It sounds like it was produced by a genius. Who could it be? Any ideas?
RB: I don't want to say really, because it could be loads of people, couldn't it?
SB: It sounds like the sort of label that would be on Broadway, but that's just a guess. It sounds like a Latin geezer produced it anyway.
Why's that?
SB: I don't know, it's got a saggy swing to it.
RB: It's the sort of guy who would probably sample his drum machines and not use them, but just sample them and get loads of Latin kids to edit them as well.
SB: It reminds me of Duke Bootee, but...
You're close.
SB: He's probably from Manhattan and he probably doesn't usually work his rappers this good.
No.
SB: I can't remember who this is. Who is it?
It's Just Ice, with Mantronik producing.
RB: Yeah, I've heard of him. He's wicked.
Was Mantronik a big influence then?
SB: What do you think? [Laughs]
RB: He's pretty fresh at covering his tracks this kid, actually. You never know - well, you know how he's done it, but...
SB: It doesn't advertise itself.
RB: For the time, the gear he had was quite advanced.
SB: He was using an SP-12 when the people around him were using an 808. Yeah, and Emus. He was fucking banging basically.
RB: He was the first kid, actually, who could control the start and stop motion of the air in music. As opposed to an 808 played out infinitely, you've got a sample that stops finitely, and he makes the most of that.
SB: Yeah, he totally understood his technology, not in terms of its imitations, just in terms of its capability. He wasn't the first to do what he was doing, but he was probably the first person who knew how to use the sampler in HipHop to create new dynamics with his kit, rather than just try to recreate existing dynamics with samplers, which is what most people were doing. In the latter half of the 80s, it was basically him getting better and everyone else getting worse, except for The Bomb Squad, who came at it from their own angle completely. That was kind of it for us then. I think he was really good at having invisible concepts in his stuff.
RB: Exactly, because HipHop kids won't go for the concepts.
SB: No, they won't. They just want the stylistic aspect of some kind of 'realness'. Whereas he was thrusting it forward.
RB: He wasn't showboating it in the end. I think he did get fucked off by everyone because he went... He was isolated for too long, that's what it was. I think he probably got so futuristic that he decided to try and keep up with everyone else, and that's how he lost the plot, as far as where everyone else was going, and he ended up doing loads of soul records. That totally tainted him.
What do you think you took from him?
SB: It was more being inspired by him as a person really. It was just his way of being, the way he applied what he knew and what he was into.
RB: He was a bit of a Zorro.
SB: Yeah, definitely. He was a bit of a hero. It's kind of weird because you just remember what you thought about as a kid rather than remembering it. I couldn't really say now what he was doing in terms of technique that was spinning me out. I think it was just that he was always pushing. Cheese was the same. I mean Cheese was producing stuff at the same time, around 86, that was really well done, absolutely lushly made. He embodies a lot of things that people now take for granted, especially Jungle producers.
Born in 1970 and 1972 respectively, Rob Brown and Sean Booth were both raised on a steady diet of Mantronix, graffiti, BMXs and 808 State. After meeting in 1987 and a stint on pirate radio in Manchester, the duo released their first single, "Cavity Job", under the name MYSLB Productions in 1991. Brown and Booth wouldn't enter the public eye until the following year, though, when Autechre's "The Egg" and "Crystel" appeared on Warp's scene-defining Artificial Intelligence compilation. Their debut album, Incunabula, was released in 1993, its slightly skewed Electro following a schematic diagram all their own. A hermetic exploration of the contours of their favourite Roland 303 and 606 machines. Autechre's 1994 album, Amber, was their breakthrough. After releasing the Anti EP, which contained deliberately 'non-repetitive' beats, they followed suit with Tri Repetae (1995), Chiastic Slide (1997) and last year LP5, developing opaque electronic shapes carved out of system dirt and put together according to rules that were anything but Euclidean. EPs for Clear and Skam as Gescom (short for Gestalt Communications) may or may not have been Booth and Brown. Autechre's Peel Sessions are released this month on Warp, and the duo are currently holed up in Sheffield working on their own software projects.
JUST ICE
"Cold Gettin' Dumb" from Absolutely The Very Best Of Old School HipHop
(Castle)
Sean Booth: This sounds gorgeous. I reckon that i would have really liked this in 1986 if it came out on a label from New York. Oh, we've got to gess who this is.
Rob Brown: It's well out of time, isn't it?
SB: It sounds like it was produced by a genius. Who could it be? Any ideas?
RB: I don't want to say really, because it could be loads of people, couldn't it?
SB: It sounds like the sort of label that would be on Broadway, but that's just a guess. It sounds like a Latin geezer produced it anyway.
Why's that?
SB: I don't know, it's got a saggy swing to it.
RB: It's the sort of guy who would probably sample his drum machines and not use them, but just sample them and get loads of Latin kids to edit them as well.
SB: It reminds me of Duke Bootee, but...
You're close.
SB: He's probably from Manhattan and he probably doesn't usually work his rappers this good.
No.
SB: I can't remember who this is. Who is it?
It's Just Ice, with Mantronik producing.
RB: Yeah, I've heard of him. He's wicked.
Was Mantronik a big influence then?
SB: What do you think? [Laughs]
RB: He's pretty fresh at covering his tracks this kid, actually. You never know - well, you know how he's done it, but...
SB: It doesn't advertise itself.
RB: For the time, the gear he had was quite advanced.
SB: He was using an SP-12 when the people around him were using an 808. Yeah, and Emus. He was fucking banging basically.
RB: He was the first kid, actually, who could control the start and stop motion of the air in music. As opposed to an 808 played out infinitely, you've got a sample that stops finitely, and he makes the most of that.
SB: Yeah, he totally understood his technology, not in terms of its imitations, just in terms of its capability. He wasn't the first to do what he was doing, but he was probably the first person who knew how to use the sampler in HipHop to create new dynamics with his kit, rather than just try to recreate existing dynamics with samplers, which is what most people were doing. In the latter half of the 80s, it was basically him getting better and everyone else getting worse, except for The Bomb Squad, who came at it from their own angle completely. That was kind of it for us then. I think he was really good at having invisible concepts in his stuff.
RB: Exactly, because HipHop kids won't go for the concepts.
SB: No, they won't. They just want the stylistic aspect of some kind of 'realness'. Whereas he was thrusting it forward.
RB: He wasn't showboating it in the end. I think he did get fucked off by everyone because he went... He was isolated for too long, that's what it was. I think he probably got so futuristic that he decided to try and keep up with everyone else, and that's how he lost the plot, as far as where everyone else was going, and he ended up doing loads of soul records. That totally tainted him.
What do you think you took from him?
SB: It was more being inspired by him as a person really. It was just his way of being, the way he applied what he knew and what he was into.
RB: He was a bit of a Zorro.
SB: Yeah, definitely. He was a bit of a hero. It's kind of weird because you just remember what you thought about as a kid rather than remembering it. I couldn't really say now what he was doing in terms of technique that was spinning me out. I think it was just that he was always pushing. Cheese was the same. I mean Cheese was producing stuff at the same time, around 86, that was really well done, absolutely lushly made. He embodies a lot of things that people now take for granted, especially Jungle producers.
...
DAVID TUDOR
"Pulsers" from Three Works For Live Electronics (Lovely Music)
SB: It sounds like Chris Carter.
RB: Is it a live recording?
Yes.
RB: I wouldn't mind seeing that.
SB: It sounds great whoever it is. It's not David Tudor or something, is it?
Yes, a live recording from 1976.
SB: He's got a weird ear, I reckon.
Do you think there's anything new you can do with electronics live that you can't do in the studio?
SB: Yeah, completely. You're completely linear, you can only deal with one time frame. You've got the ability to alter your perspective, or your working environment within that time frame can be completely under your control. Live, you can give yourself as much or as little control as you want.
RB: You're more of a conduit live, definitely.
SB: You are definetly confined to working within one time frame and in a purely linear way, so you're not really concerned with future events in the same way, so you're not really concerned with past events a little bit differently, but not as much. It definitely changes the way you work on stuff - you're miles more concerned with stuff in the present than you are when you work in the studio, because there is no present. Unless you're working a live way in the studio, which is like, uh, live, innit= [Laughs]
RB: Yeah, but you know that it's going to be approached and appraised with the attitude that you've been in the studio.
SB: If that's what you've decided to do... I think the dividing line is getting really slim because there's so many things now that you can change. When he was doing stuff, without a massive network of computers, you couldn't do it... There's so many different ways of doing it now that the question of whether it's live or not is almost irrelevant, because you're making something for yourself to use, then you use it and give it as much flexibility as possible. It's just like DJing, really.
In rock, there's an element of danger in doing it live, you can screw up royally, but in electronics that element of risk seems to be less prevalent.
RB: No, I don't think so. It depends on how much risk you give yourself really.
SB: Leaving one sound open on the synth that you can edit is allowing yourself to fuck up. Controlling the filter curves is allowing yourself to fuck up, if the resonances are set too high. There's potential for fucking up all over what we do. It's silly to say that an electronic gig can't sound shit if you press the wrong buttons.
RB: Yeah, totally. There's a million duff notes to be heard at any sort of gig.
SB: There's no more or less chances to fuck up than a guitar band has. At least in a guitar band, someone screws up, the rest of the band can keep playing.
RB: Let's face it, someone like Jim O'Rourke playing an acoustic guitar in front of a microphone is just as risky. It is weird relying on these boxes.. If you use tools that you've designed, then you've got to be a little bit more intelligent than the next man because if it breaks, one, it's your fault and, two, if you fix it, you know how it works and, three, you've learned something.
DICK RAAIJMAKERS
"Ping Pong" from The Complete Works (Donemus)
SB: It's nice, this. What is this? This is really nice.
RB: Ping pong.
Yes, it's a recording of two contact-miked ping pong paddles. You were trying to find the algorithm of a decelerating ball, is that right?
SB: That was something we did two years ago. It's just basic math. That was when were first getting into generative... Generative is such a fucking stupid word, actually. It's not at all generative. It's sort of hyper-creative, I suppose. It's a nasty word. Anyway, that was one of the first things we did, trying to work out...
RB: It's structural, really.
SB: We were doing that in 1995, 96. That was when we started to use computers and stuff.
Why did you get into that?
SB: I think we realised that we were a lot more capable with MIDI and maths. MIDI is just a pretty amazing integer system. You could just do a lot with it and once we clicked into that, things just expanded.
Do you think there's something funny about turning maths into music?
SB: One is the other anyway.
RB: Listening to old stuff that you've done, using the same principles, but not actually planning those principles, but just exploring them and getting into them, realising that once you've got this machine you can suss out a lot of the principles. The actual beauty in the numbers used to create structures, it's incredible interesting.
You're making your own software now, is that right?
SB: Yeah. There isn't an aim to it, really. A lot of it isn't music, it's just stuff that we're interested in.
RB: Animation, really. Not in terms of graphic representation, but something that you can develop.
SB: Or something that animates itself, or something that will animate other things. It's all different kinds of motion. It's all time-based, everything we do is. But it's not all sound.
RB: [refering to the track] Who's winning? I don't think they're playing a serious game. Some should record a Chinese master game. It would be more 90s, wouldn't it? [Laughs]
SB: It would be so fucking dynamic, though.
RB: Yeah, but it would be over in about 90 seconds.
SB: It would be better if they were good players, I reckon.
...
COIL
"Dimethoxy-4-Ethyl-Amphetamine" from Time Machines (Eskaton)
RB: I was just going to say the heating system's got a tone to it.
[They both adopt bugged-out faces and stare at the table in silence for about two minutes]
SB: It sounds like Coil. Is it that Time Machines? Yeah, fucking hell.
RB: It's weird because it sounds a lot older.
SB: I can't listen to it anymore. I can't play it anymore. The last time I heard this it really spun me out. It's fucking stunning this CD.
Aren't you working with them?
SB: It's a long, slow process.
Are you exchanging tapes?
SB: Ideas more.
RB: Yeah, throw a spanner in the works as well.
SB: Nuff respect, wicked.
What is it about Coil that you respond to?
SB: That's the thing you can't say. It's about opening doorways, I think. They open loads of doorways. They don't always go all the way into it, but they just sort of show you this doorway and it's just such a spin out sometimes.
RB: Coil are just in a sphere. Usually it's quite captivating. They're quite a captive band, really. No matter what they do, there's something in there that's just absolutely them and it keeps you in there.
Did you used to listen to Dead Can Dance as well?
SB: Yeah, a little bit. Selective bits. Not too much of the cheesy World/ethno stuff, more the later stuff. I reckon that "The Host Of Seraphin" is gorgeous. That's the end of what I was into. I was more into taht than the instrument specialist tracks.
Did the industrial movement mean anything to you?
SB: We didn't come from that point of view at all. We used to go to this Hardcore club, and the DJ, who was totally decent, we were doing this radio thing with him, he played it. He played tracks from Love's Secret Domain at 45, just totally fucking them up. He was always into weird stuff as well.
RB: Yeah, he used to tormet his audience quite a bit. He'd be playing to rave crowds, dropping Coil at 45 in the mix.
SB: He was totally stunning, looking back. We bought everything they were doing around that time and then just went backwards and tried to get as much stuff as possible. It's so dense. They're really into what they're doing at a pretty intimate level. There's only them and :zoviet*france: and The Hafler Trio that made any impression on us, at that time. A bit of Chris & Cosey, too, I suppose.
Do you think you share a hermetic stance with thouse guys?
SB: I think it's how you go about listening to it. I think if you're preapred to be barraged by certain things, then you accept it as part of the plan. It starts to work, it's pretty weird. Coil have a knack o making things that are pretty sickly anywhere else and making them totally apparent. I mean, this is absolutely amazing. It's so fucking easy to do, but it's totally effective.
...
LFO
"Mentok 1" from Frequencies (Warp)
SB: Rah.
RB: Who selects the music then?
Committee.
[Both laughs] RB: Committee. That's a very diplomatic response.
OK, how about junta?
SB: LFO just hit us from the chart. Nobody I knew was going out to listen to it. Everybody got into [Sweet Exorcist's] "Testone" when that came out and everyone got into "The Theme" and Forgemasters "Track With No Name"...
RB; I remember there were two LFOs out at the same time. That was the time when there were like a million records coming out a week, all copying each other.
SB: That's true. It wasn't until the album came out that I totally got... The B-side was pretty awesome. I totally lost it to the album, I thought it was amazing.
RB: You just expect all those 12"scoming out at the same time, you just think there's going to be a million more to replace it. And then for someone seemingly out of dance, to hear them do a full-length album was totally worthwile.
SB: Totally lush.
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